[ Post a Response | JDJ American Bulldog Preservation Board ]
Posted by Mark @ Big Sky Kennels
(bigsky) on 2/26/2008, 9:20 am, in reply to "Re: Hips One of the Biggest side steps breeders make "
67.142.130.24
Red ,
You are always been in my prayers since I heard of your service for our country I have the deepest respect for Armed service men who fight for my freedom(I come from a long line of military background not counting my own service)and to say what I believe so I pray you respect me in the same way for what I am about to say because it appears we see differently and I am not clear why yet?
You have two AB's and one of them has bad hips? That should of been a wake up call for you yes? Or you knowing we have a dysplastic breed in your research meant nothing to you or your family? It might not of been that bad if your bulldog can still walk but kids seeing a bulldog that can't walk and then being put down tears the kids heart out no? Please No Disrespect to you but have you taken the time to research improvements in this bred? I'm honestly trying to figure out where your at?
Or are you just listening to the guys on the porch ? If a breeder wants to sit on the porch and refuse to do there best to make sure the bare minimum of having tight hips before breeding after having the tools/scientific instruments than they are a huge reason the problem will go on and who wants to co-sign that? Would you not agree to that? They may have seen lots of bulldogs but turning there heads to the health problem with there hips is not to me worth sitting on a porch and listening to someone ,make a ton of money off Bulldogs and me knowing they willingly are Why would one want to sit on the porch of these Breeders knowing that they have been around for so many years and are still part of the problem? That does not make since to me? To me they are still breeding for money and not to better the bred?
If a breeder wants his bloodlines improved then he should use the tool correct? Why not if they are breeding to improve this Beautiful breed? Correct? We can all learn something everyday I try to and when I stop learning then guess what I’m left in the dark one thing I have learned in this world is that changes happen and on a positive note I have seen many more breeders waking up to the fact that we need to get on board about this huge problem and have enough guts to not co-sign the guys at the top who don’t care about hips that’s a death blow to improvement if there legs are not good as Bryan said God Bless his courage as a so called new-bie we all started someplace ,in my opinion he has Bulldog guts!!!
Who cares if other unscrupulous breeders manipulate there scores or whatever excuse a person uses to not bottom line spend the money to PH there Bulldogs? Personally I don't care who manipulates scores why it about my bloodlines and improving my bloodlines forget about the person who manipulates scores on there bulldogs? That does not make since to not do yours because others manipulate "if" you truly want to improve your Bulldogs correct? I have proven PH reduces the CHD by seeing what happens when used and when not used! I've seen many Bulldogs improved look at the 18-20 years of breeding with PH has produced in my Bulldogs? Whats going to happen "If" we co-sign older breeders who refuse to open there eyes to this problem? I've been around long enough to see the few breeders start PHing there Bulldogs and end up getting out because this breed was such a mess and so called Big name breeders were not addressing this problem! Now guess thats just hear-say coming from a guy whos just selling his dogs on his hips merrit alone? Experience is the best teacher ,and bottom line Bryan is right consumers are waking up ,there are tons of dysplastic puppies put out every year and people don't come and get another one? why? Just sit back and think how huge this problem is and what is motivating the problem?When you see whats driving the problem then and onl;y then can you be part of the solution of this. Nothing said out of anything but hard learned experience. Follow the money? Thats all it takes and bottom line it takes money to improve this breed because getting bulldogs that have generations are expensive! Why because they are worth it. JMO ,God Bless: Mark
: Just so you know, I have two AB's and have PennHipped one and will PennHip the other
: once I return home. As I said I believe it is a good TOOL if it is not manipulated
: and if you do not believe some people are manipulating scores for as you say $$$$
: than that is ignorant. Tell me how worse off is this breed today than it was 20yrs
: ago? And if it is then why is it worse? Hmmm..becuase people are bringing in oldest
: and pits and other outcross? Possibly because people are breeding without obtaining
: the knowledge first? Like I said X-ray and breed. Forget getting to know and
: understand the special characteristics of this breed just go to the vet and get an
: x-ray.
:
: Look the point I am attempting to make is PennHip is a good tool and could if used
: right and not manipulated help lessen HD. At the same time I WILL NOT snub nose and
: look down on people who have been doing this long before these studies were
: available and have produced hog dogs, working dogs and show dogs. These people are
: people us “newbie’s” need to sit on the porches with and learn as much as we can.
: Believe me I guarantee they can teach us much more than a Vet can.
:
: These 3,4,5, Gens of pennhipped dogs that have had ALL their offspring tested also
: who are they?
:
: --Previous Message--
:
: I'm sorry people but I personaly thanks it's ignorant to descredit the importance of
: the PH tests. WITHOUT THE PENNHIP TESTS THE BREED WILL ONLY CONTINUE TO BE A
: DYSPLASTIC BREED AND WITH PEOPLE BREEDING WITH THIS KEEN EYE I KEEP HEARING ABOUT
: ARE GOING TO BE LEFT BEHIND. I do agree that certain cases of HD will be caught by
: someone that knows what there doing but there will be more than not more that slip
: through the cracks and be bred without the use of PENNHIP TESTS. I say PH because I
: think for the most part OFA is a joke. I read in a study where PH was 236% more
: likely to remove HD from a persons breeding program than OFA. The proof is in the
: pooding. If I wanted to take the time I could put together some many FACTS AND
: SCIENTIFIC STUDIES THAT WOULD PROVE THAT PH IS THE #1 KEY TO REDUCING HD IN THIS
: BREED. Now I haven't been around long but it doesn't take a rocket scietist to see
: the benifits of using PH. I have a 4 yr old dog that has a mild case of HD and
: rarely if ever shows signs. Tell me how you can tell he had it without a test when
: he runs like a dear, has almost perfect conformation with no cowhocking, and can
: stand on his hind legs, and stop on a dime. I didn't see any signs at all until he
: was bred and was almost 3 1/2yrs old. By that time the damage was done. It wasn't
: until at 3 1/2 yrs that on a cold day he packed one leg and I took him to the vet
: and he was x-rayed and found to be dysplastic. I give him Rymadil for about a week
: and now he is running like a deer again and I will proove it to anyone. Bottom line
: though the dog has a gene for HD and should not be breed. Without x-rays this would
: have never been known until I saw the signs. PennHIpping would have caught this and
: the dog would not have been bred. I know of several dogs that have 3,4,5 gen of PH
: dogs in there pedigree and with each gen the scores got better and the number of
: dogs being replaced virtually disappeared. How can people ignore these facts? MONEY
: THAT'S HOW. That's the only possible answer or that they have 15 yrs invested in a
: breeding program that they don't want to admit has been flawed and has not bettered
: the dogs as far as HD goes, so IMO not bettered the breed. Now Hips aren't the only
: thing to look for but if a dog can't walk it doesn't really matter much how good his
: pigment, temp, conformation, or anything for that matter. Get real. I have people
: calling everyday that have never owned an American Bulldog but took the time to do
: research before buying one. They have made up there own mind what to look for
: without any outside influenced so to speak. They all ask the same first question.
: What health tests have been done? Have they been PH? They know this is a dysplastic
: breed and without scientific testing how can anyone know for a fact what there
: breeding. Doesn't most people look fine and then go in for a colonoscopy and find
: out they have colon cancer when they would have lived for 1-2 more years before the
: signs were there let's say. They would have caught it in time to save there life
: with a test or be dead because they went with the eyeball method. What a joke. I'm
: sorry but falling in love with a dog and having it crippled no matter if you get
: another pup or your money back your hearts broke. I will not breed dogs without hip
: testing and the people that keep eyeballing it no matter how much experience will be
: left behing.
:
:
:
Responses:
Board Administrator: Mark Moler
Co-Administrators: Paul Ciancio, Rob Barry,
and John Healy
