JDJ American Bulldog Preservation Board: Re: Red

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Re: Red

Posted by Red (SSG Remaley) on 2/27/2008, 6:28 am, in reply to "Re: Red"
213.132.254.2

Ok.. for the last time, I have said this in every so post let me say it in another way. I have and will Penn Hip my dogs. Why? becuase I do lack the experience and knowledge and I do believe it would help control the rate of HD. I also believe that a true dog man/women, an person whom has done for yrs including Mark I beleive these people haveor at least should have enough knowledge and expeirnce to know if a dog is breed worthy. My males hips tested in the median oh but guess what he ended up with OCD, Penn Hip did not pick this up. Point is there are more than hip problems in this breed. Oh and I do not have a yard, I have one male that I have neautered and one female. Now onto OCD some vets say heritary some say not, guess I could have went and breed him anyway. NOPE I did the right thing for the breed. So as you and I disagree on this subject we do agree on improvinng this breed. I just do not believe that one way is right for everyone again we have to agree to disagree. Seems like you are doing what you believe is right and that is what matters. I do what I beleive is right and that is what matters. (remebrer I said I penn hipp) But I also believe there are those that do not need penn hip to eveal a dog. As for the dogs that you mention about not ever producing bad hips. How many litters are we talking about and in all of those litters all of those dogs were scored? We know that most of these dogs go to pet homes and are never scored, lets be honest. I am not knocking the dogs because as i stated before I beleive that staacking gens of gens of pennhipp dogs will help. but to believe that three dogs producing many many litters and never producing bad hips? Well damn that is something to be proud about. Is there a way to post those,say what 30-50 scores on all those offspring? Again I am not saying anything about the dogs just saying that is a hell of an accomplishment (i have always like Zech) Look we are just gonna go in circles with this. If you think that i am foolish and i do not have the best intrest of the dogs at heart, so be it. As for getting sick and tired hey, read my whole post, i never said anything negative about the penn hip I USE IT. and you comment on the vets, i totaly agree and to take it a step further how many vets out there do have enoug expeirnce in AB's...that was the point I was making all along and not just AB"s how many have enough expeirnce to positin the dog correctly for the proper x-ray. We agree on many things we just disagree on one point. that there are people skilled adn knowledgable enought not to need these studies. I will stna my grpound on my believe and you will stand yours. again it is what it is. I wish you luck with your yard, it seems like you are truly trying to do the right thing. Remeber the more u try and force feed things the more it will be rejected. I learned that the hard way, things are better recieved with facts and friendship than telling everyone they are wrong becuase they do not share the same views and beliefs.

Nice talking with you guys but I am done on this subject, we will only continue to disagree. This is the most dog talk i have had in ove ra year damni can not wait to get back...

Have a good one
Red
--Previous Message--
: Hey Red it is what it is huh? Well this is how it is. We're not talking about a dogs
: hips we are testing them with a scietific method that when used right works. I am
: getting sick and tired of people saying that a scietific test isn't worth the paper
: it's written on when it is a repeatable test that can be done over and over with
: virtually no change. I agree that the PH test taker has to be properly schooled on
: taking the test. You can't compare hips of a lab to hips of an AB it doesn't work
: that way if it did they would lump all the PH scores into one category instead of
: doing it by each breed. If a vet has only done 2 or 3 AB's than she isn't qualified
: IMO to make a descision that would be the right one. That's the same with people
: thanking they can look at a dog and tell it has great hips. Bullsh$%. Noone can do
: it 100% of the time, no way. I do agree that there are volumes of things you can
: learn from the old timers and one of them is when they did it the wrong ways learn
: from it and do it the right way. If they keep getting dysplastic dogs that should
: tell you something. I know a few breeders who have virtually wiped HD out of there
: program using PH. How can people dispute that? Oh I know they can't so they say
: whoever it is, is lieing and is replacing them but telling everyone else he's not. I
: believe I will have to call Bullsh$% again on that. Whenever someone does something
: wrong in this breed it hits the airwaves in seconds. How can you dispute what I said
: about Rahab of Big Sky who has about 5 gen of PH dogs on top and bottom of her
: pedigree and has to my knowledge not produce a HD dog or her mom either or Atomics
: Zech of Big Sky, has he ever produced a HD dog. Not to my knowledge he hasn't. You
: can contribute that to the fact he father was tested and so was his mother and he's
: a great stud too. The more and more gen are stacked on top of each other people
: will see those dogs will not produce bad hips except on rare occasions. The proof is
: right there. Believe what you want to believe. Red you seem like a good guy and Mark
: said you fought for our country and for my that means we are all in your debt. I
: agree that there are things to be learned from old timers and one of them is to not
: keep eyeballing your breeding stock and test them so you can quit producing as many
: HD dogs. If people as breeders would not do everything in there power to insure a
: betterment of the breed with each breeding than they shouldn't do it. When they see
: proof that it is working and still don't do it that tells me that there motives run
: more shallow than bettering the breed. Truely you would save money by PH IMO because
: you wouldn't have to replace several $1500 dogs with more $1500 dogs. You would as I
: said virtually wipe it out and not have to replace a dog and get to keep all the
: money. Did you guys here me make more money. Will that get you to change your mind.
: Red I still try to see the good but it's getting harder. Those people you speak of a
: far and few in the world today. Especially when it comes to breeders of any breed.
: They may start out with grand ideas of doing the right thing and them poof they get
: sucked into being a bitter person all about the money. I see now that people's
: character isn't what I thought it was. The average day on the preservation board is
: about 4 or 5 posts. Since this subject hit the board watch out. It's 30 now. That's
: because people have a lot invested in that so called character you speak of and if
: found to be wrong would make there character look not so good. I am new I've been
: around about 5 yrs. Not too long but Long enough to have some idea what's going on,
: you know the history, the history that no one likes to talk about. Once you know
: that then you start to see the motives behind the scenes it's rediculous. In the end
: it should be about the dogs. NOt about you, your buddy or anyone else the dogs are
: what it should be about. So if there is something out there , anything that will
: help me breed a better dog I will do it. To me that's what one does when they truely
: care is whatever it takes. To me that's what speaks volumes about a man's character.
: I'm done with this because I could care less about your yard but I do care about
: what comes from people's yard into the unsuspecting general public that isn't as
: healthy as it could be and pollutes the gene pool that I hope I can do my small part
: to fix. I guess I'm pissing in the wind and it's going to get all over me but I will
: do it for my dogs, because I love'm.
: