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"We have concluded that when the principle of racial division (i.e. phyletism) is juxtaposed with the teaching of the Gospel and the constant practice of the Church, it is not only foreign to it, but also completely opposed, to it. We decree the following in the Holy Spirit: 1. We reject and condemn racial division, that is, racial differences, national quarrels and disagreements in the Church of Christ, as being contrary to the teaching of the Gospel and the holy canons of our blessed fathers, on which the holy Church is established and which adorn human society and lead it to Divine piety. 2. In accordance with the holy canons, we proclaim that those who accept such division according to races and who dare to base on it hitherto unheard-of racial assemblies are foreign to the One, Holy, Catholic and Apostolic Church and are real schismatics." Constantinople...1872 * Pray and Work for Orthodox Unity in North America!!! * St. Andrew House announces Agreement to fund Orthodox Unity effort for years to come - see www.orthodoxdetroit.com * Welcome to the St. Andrew House Discussion Forum * Coming Soon - Orthodox Business Directory * Visit our Home Page at www.orthodoxdetroit.com

    Re: Discretion and denial ....

    Posted by Leo on 4/8/2008, 6:37 am, in reply to "Re: Discretion and denial cannot overcome demographics."

    Harry,

    The problem is that there are zero people previously married in that group -- for the first time in our church history, indeed human history. Almost zero working age widowers since safe Cesarian operations and the medicine necessary to make that possible were accepted widely.

    Ah. You said something like that before, but for some reason I didn't catch it. ALTHOUGH... it is considered possible for a married man to be consecrated bishop if his wife agrees to enter a (women's, obviously) monastery (even as *he's* entering monasticism in becoming bishop). This was done in Japan by a semi-canonical jurisdiction once in the 20th century, and I think I've read about it from ancient or medieval times too in the Near East. Of course, this wouldn't necessarily work if they have minor children, ALTHOUGH St. Innocent of Alaska would only become a bishop if his minors were taken care of by the Church back in Russia, like in schools, orphanages, whatever (I forget exactly what ages they were). Today we in America are opposed to institutional childrearing - for good or for ill - and so close off this option to ourselves and our Church - for good or for ill.

    The work-a-day bishops in all the regional town centers -- THOSE were the men the locals respected, THOSE were the men who knew the actual measure of the burdens and joys of family and struggle, THOSE were the work-a-day clergy that kept the church going where in counts -- among the people. Not students of family life, veterans of it.

    I will admit - coming from the RCC - to always being intrigued when I hear of a widowed monastic, abbot, bishop, Primate, like this person will have that hands-on experience of married life and parenthood to draw on or reflect from, that a never-married one (hopefully!) doesn't. One of the OCA's pre-autocephaly Primates was, and I still did a double-take last year when I read that his last grandchild had reposed, I'm so unused to it! (Memory Eternal to them both.) OTOH, the only widowed RCC priest I ever knew - his wife died of cancer, childless, the poor thing, in their early 30s - was mostly a total wacko. Widowhood doesn't guarantee anything, and I think neither does never having been married, in priestly, spiritual-fatherly, confessional, or episcopal performance, or the Glory of God, but holiness, virtue, collaboration, humble leadership, and firmness when necessary ... among all the other things, do.

    Coming from a 44-year-old single-still-looking!!!

    --Leo


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