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Jam & Sugarit and wtf

Posted by Beezabryan <iframe src='https://members5.boardhost.com/classicbikemart/info/user=Beezabryan' width='330' height='300' border=0 style='border:none;'> on August 5, 2024, 4:53 pm

Had GP apointment this morning. Went to car with plenty of time to get across town. Key in ignition and what? nothing, nada, zilch, sfa etc
After my enforced no driving period it had started OK though not been used since.
Local cab firm got me there & back.

Later back home I did a battery check - 12.7v
WTF that is more than enough to kick it over.
Tried spare key, immediate fire up!
Looks like the immobiliser does not respond to one of the keys, why would that be?

BeezaBryan

He knows not where he's going, For the ocean will decide,
Its not the destination, It's the glory of the ride (Edward Monkton, Zen Dog)

Re: Jam & Sugarit and wtf

Posted by Andy C <iframe src='https://members5.boardhost.com/classicbikemart/info/user=Andy+C' width='330' height='300' border=0 style='border:none;'> on August 5, 2024, 5:53 pm, in reply to "Jam & Sugarit and wtf"

"Looks like the immobiliser does not respond to one of the keys, why would that be?"

Low battery ?

Who needs a signature anyway......

Re: Jam & Sugarit and wtf

Posted by Beezabryan <iframe src='https://members5.boardhost.com/classicbikemart/info/user=Beezabryan' width='330' height='300' border=0 style='border:none;'> on August 5, 2024, 6:04 pm, in reply to "Re: Jam & Sugarit and wtf"

Recent new battery in key Andy and central locking works fine.

BeezaBryan

He knows not where he's going, For the ocean will decide,
Its not the destination, It's the glory of the ride (Edward Monkton, Zen Dog)

Re: Jam & Sugarit and wtf

Posted by Will <iframe src='https://members5.boardhost.com/classicbikemart/info/user=Will' width='330' height='300' border=0 style='border:none;'> on August 5, 2024, 6:39 pm, in reply to "Re: Jam & Sugarit and wtf"

Is it one of those coin shape batteries? I've had loads of trouble with them.......

Nearly new ones failing. Maybe old stock = They do have limited shelf life & use by dates.

A loose fit in the key fob makes for unreliable contact. Very carefully "adjust" the contacts in fob or find a way of stopping the battery rattling about in the fob.

And my bike key fob won't work remmotely after a few days not in use. But hold it in the emergency start position* & it works straight away, and then continues to work for the rest of the day.

(*emergency start position: not sure if cars have this but its a point on the bikes bodywork close to the antenna where the fob will work even with a dud battery).

Re: Jam & Sugarit and wtf

Posted by Hants Ian <iframe src='https://members5.boardhost.com/classicbikemart/info/user=Hants+Ian' width='330' height='300' border=0 style='border:none;'> on August 5, 2024, 6:49 pm, in reply to "Re: Jam & Sugarit and wtf"

The immobiliser chips in the gear fobs are not battery powered
If the fob batteries go flat you should be able to open the door manually with the ignition still working. When you place the key in the lock or close to it the receiver by the lock sends a signal to the chip which is bounced back. If the signal is acceptable by the ECU it will allow the vehicle to start
If the key is dropped sometimes this can damage the chip
The chip which is very small can often fall out if the fob comes apart.

The light at the end of the tunnel maybe an oncoming train

Re: Jam & Sugarit and wtf

Posted by BeezaBryan2 <iframe src='https://members5.boardhost.com/classicbikemart/info/user=BeezaBryan2' width='330' height='300' border=0 style='border:none;'> on August 5, 2024, 7:08 pm, in reply to "Re: Jam & Sugarit and wtf"

Thanks Ian, when I'm more able I'll get the key fob checked out & replaced if need be.
In the meantime I have no real need of a car.
Family member taking us to wednesday hospital appointment and thursday to another GP session.

Re: Jam & Sugarit and wtf

Posted by spriddler <iframe src='https://members5.boardhost.com/classicbikemart/info/user=spriddler' width='330' height='300' border=0 style='border:none;'> on August 5, 2024, 6:58 pm, in reply to "Re: Jam & Sugarit and wtf"

Is the main key on a ring with other keys or odds and bobs and the spare on its own?
I've had occasional trouble with my m/home as my StrikeBack immobiliser activates, preventing me from starting the engine even with the correct key or the spare in the ignition.
An AA chap said it's quite well known to happen if it receives stray (blocking) radio or microwave signals. E.G. a car park (hospital) CCTV, Security staff radios, Phone mast or vehicle and traffic monitoring systems.
The last time I had it happen the AA chap and I pushed the m/h 10 yds and all was good again.
Apparently the environment is absolutely saturated with radio waves of one sort or another.

'There is a tide in the affairs of men
Which taken at at the flood.....'

Re: Jam & Sugarit and wtf

Exactly right when I was a AA patrol I was always having to move cars from phone masts. You can have problems outside some military sites.

The light at the end of the tunnel maybe an oncoming train

Re: Jam & Sugarit and wtf

Thanks Sprid. The only additional bit of kit in my car is my Inogen oxygen concentrator, not caused anything untoward in the different cars I benn passenger in.
However when next I move the car I will try the duff key see what happens.

Re: Jam & Sugarit and wtf

Is the main key on a ring with other keys or odds and bobs and the spare on its own?

Yes they are.

Re: Jam & Sugarit and wtf

Yes they are....[on a keyring with other odds and bobs]

I know it seems ridiculous but other metallic items on a keyring can also block or corrupt the fob signal if they just happen to be in a certain proximity or arrangement at the moment when you try to start.

'There is a tide in the affairs of men
Which taken at at the flood.....'

Re: Jam & Sugarit and wtf

Posted by geoff the bonnie <iframe src='https://members5.boardhost.com/classicbikemart/info/user=geoff+the+bonnie' width='330' height='300' border=0 style='border:none;'> on August 5, 2024, 9:13 pm, in reply to "Re: Jam & Sugarit and wtf"

When you change battery in a car key, there is a small piece of plastic sitting loose in the key. This is vital for the key to work. I changed a battery and lost that tiny plastic chip so the key would open doors but not start the car. Hard lesson learned as a new key is near £100

Re: Jam & Sugarit and wtf

The chip.looks like a piece of finger nail black with writing on it.

The light at the end of the tunnel maybe an oncoming train

Re: Jam & Sugarit and wtf

On the Peugeot 206, it was a tiny plastic black square section. Just looked like a piece of plastic had snapped off. That car is long gone now though.

Re: Jam & Sugarit and wtf

Posted by Leon Novello <iframe src='https://members5.boardhost.com/classicbikemart/info/user=Leon+Novello' width='330' height='300' border=0 style='border:none;'> on August 6, 2024, 6:08 am, in reply to "Jam & Sugarit and wtf"

Strange, the 2001 Mazda`s key still has the original battery.

Leon Novello

Re: Jam & Sugarit and wtf

Posted by 6TDen <iframe src='https://members5.boardhost.com/classicbikemart/info/user=6TDen' width='330' height='300' border=0 style='border:none;'> on August 6, 2024, 7:30 am, in reply to "Re: Jam & Sugarit and wtf"

Take good care of it Leon, it's probably worth more than the car.
Den

Re: Jam & Sugarit and wtf

Posted by MadMike <iframe src='https://members5.boardhost.com/classicbikemart/info/user=MadMike' width='330' height='300' border=0 style='border:none;'> on August 6, 2024, 9:12 am, in reply to "Jam & Sugarit and wtf"

Keys for opening and starting your cars? How very 20th century..

Ours all have keyless entry and starting. Get close enough to the car and it will open when you touch the door handle and you can start it with the key remaining in your pocket. Once you park and stop the engine, walk away and it even locks the cars for us.

Battery life? Well mine is 2.5 years old now, and when the battery voltage drops the car even gives you a warning message that the battery needs changing.

Other opinions may be available but this one is always correct.

Re: Jam & Sugarit and wtf

Posted by geoff the bonnie <iframe src='https://members5.boardhost.com/classicbikemart/info/user=geoff+the+bonnie' width='330' height='300' border=0 style='border:none;'> on August 6, 2024, 10:15 am, in reply to "Re: Jam & Sugarit and wtf"

Not had to change a battery in any of the cars i bought new. Mine is keyless of course. Just stand near it and open the door. Some of the new cars still require thew key to be inserted. First car i had keyless was a 2005 Renault Megane.
I notice many manufacturers have stopped fitting the boot opening by waving your foot under a sensor.
Next advance is the Toyota solid state battery EV expecting to have a 600 mile range and 10 minute charge. Now, i would have that but its still a few years wait.

Re: Jam & Sugarit and wtf

Posted by Lannis <iframe src='https://members5.boardhost.com/classicbikemart/info/user=Lannis' width='330' height='300' border=0 style='border:none;'> on August 6, 2024, 12:08 pm, in reply to "Re: Jam & Sugarit and wtf"

They've been just around the corner for 110 years now. Just a few more years, trust me ....

Lannis

I don't take health advice from people who think the world is overpopulated.

Re: Jam & Sugarit and wtf

Posted by Brickboy <iframe src='https://members5.boardhost.com/classicbikemart/info/user=Brickboy' width='330' height='300' border=0 style='border:none;'> on August 6, 2024, 11:10 am, in reply to "Re: Jam & Sugarit and wtf"

Mike, I picked up an unusual hitch-hiker the other week. He was hitching with his Sainsbury's shopping as his keyless, and very expensive, Range Rover had been stolen by a bunch of chaps he'd spotted photographing the VIN plate in the passenger window. A few weeks later, as the police predicted to him, a car pulled up outside, a man jumped out, someone in the car with £20k worth of software pressed return, the car opened and started and was off within thirty seconds of their arrival. It's probably good that they were so quick as he didn't have a chance to tangle with what would undoubtedly be very unpleasant characters.

He'd tracked it moving at record speed towards Southampton where it would have joined a container ship to Saudi - which is apparently where they go to supply parts for wealthy sand dune drivers who crash.

As we trundled along gently in my lowly, cheap and not very desirable C Max I did suggest that in future a car with a key might be better!

He said that six or eight had been taken from the area that night and in London apparently it's many more. Could be why JLR donated a million, I think it was, to the police to help fight car crime.

Joking aside, I can't help but think it's always better not to display excessive wealth if you're lucky enough to have it. £100k stored on wheels on your drive seems like asking for trouble to me.

Re: Jam & Sugarit and wtf

IT does not take £2000 of software to do what they did. It simply needs an amplifier to detect the original key fob, it then amplifies the signal and a cloning device is used to fool the car. JLR are/were the slowest people to react to these devices despite their high value vehicles.

The solution is even simpler. Keep your spare gob in a Megan container, not on the hall table, and keep the fob you are using in a metallised pouch which creates a Faraday cage effect and blocks the amplifier signal. The added benefit of the pouch is that car keys no longer make holes in your pockets. Cost of a pouch? About £1 as I recall. In fact our local police stations were actually giving them away for free recently.

Other opinions may be available but this one is always correct.

Re: Jam & Sugarit and wtf

Posted by Will <iframe src='https://members5.boardhost.com/classicbikemart/info/user=Will' width='330' height='300' border=0 style='border:none;'> on August 6, 2024, 3:42 pm, in reply to "Re: Jam & Sugarit and wtf"

The JLR "point of view" is that the reason so many Range Rovers are stolen is not that they are easier to steal than other high end SUVs....its that they are so much more desirable.

Fact or fiction, I personally just think it makes them even less desirable!

Re: Jam & Sugarit and wtf

However their recent expensive upgrading their security has proven their excuse is nonsense. They have traditionally been the easiest cars to steal using electronics.

Other opinions may be available but this one is always correct.

Re: Jam & Sugarit and wtf

Only reporting what he said, Mike. They apparently use the VIN to access whatever they need hence protecting your fob is of no help.

But I'll definitely keep my gob in a Megan from now on

Re: Jam & Sugarit and wtf

Posted by geoff the bonnie <iframe src='https://members5.boardhost.com/classicbikemart/info/user=geoff+the+bonnie' width='330' height='300' border=0 style='border:none;'> on August 6, 2024, 9:50 pm, in reply to "Re: Jam & Sugarit and wtf"

Range Rover have found a very good way to protect the new models. Last time i was in Southampton port, there were thousands parked up waiting to be shipped out legally. They must sell very well although many have a lot of problems in early ownership.
I did have a great 400 mile ride in an LPG powered version. It carried 100 litres of LPG in two tanks on the underside. That 100 litres was all gone at about 200 miles so filled again to get back. Super seating position and quiet at motroway speeds.
Might be nice to own if money is no problem but maybe a large Merc SUV would be more reliable.

Re: Jam & Sugarit and wtf

Posted by Leon Novello <iframe src='https://members5.boardhost.com/classicbikemart/info/user=Leon+Novello' width='330' height='300' border=0 style='border:none;'> on August 7, 2024, 7:07 am, in reply to "Jam & Sugarit and wtf"

A small 12V toggle switch can be fitted beneath the dashboard or a seat in line with an ignition wire; only legal drivers would know where it is.

Leon Novello

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