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Darren Allen on what occurred between 2020 and 2022

Posted by Fionn <iframe src='https://members5.boardhost.com/xxxxx/info/user=Fionn' width='330' height='300' border=0 style='border:none;'> on June 13, 2024, 3:04 pm

Just going to leave this here...

I Remember a ‘Pandemic’
Do you?

JUN 12, 2024

Disclaimer: This piece is called ‘I remember…’ but of course my memory is not perfect. I am also not an expert in any medical science, nor am I a statistician. And, being human, I am susceptible to factual error. As such, I welcome any correction to what follows—just drop me a line and let me know where my reasoning, my data or my sources are open to question, and if I’ve erred I’ll revise what follows accordingly. Blanket dismissals based on an emotional reaction to ‘pandemic’ in scare quotes, or to one or two factual or semantic errors (i.e. ignoring the whole argument), or on ideological grounds (that I must be a fascist for advancing such an inhuman position), or on the chillingly dystopian assumption that one must be an expert to make ethical judgements, will be ignored.

Only the small secrets need to be protected. The large ones are kept secret by public incredulity.
Marshall McLuhan.

I remember a worldwide ‘pandemic’, which occurred between 2020 and 2022. During these three years the world population grew,1 all-cause mortality rates were not wildly abnormal,2 hospitals were so empty staff could spend their time making amusing dance videos and the good old fashioned flu mysteriously vanished from medical records as a cause of death. The IFR3 of this ‘pandemic’ was similar to a bad year of the flu, perhaps a very bad year (such as the 1957 flu epidemic).4 It overwhelmingly struck people in their seventies and eighties (i.e. at the age they die anyway), it did not kill children, those most susceptible to deadly illnesses of this sort, it did not kill celebrities under the age of 50, and, miraculously, it left the whole continent of Africa unscathed.5 I also remember that the data that revealed all this was openly available at the time, just as it is now.

There clearly was a rise in all-cause mortality during the ‘pandemic’ years, there clearly was a virus killing people. The reason I am making it possible to instantly dismiss my position, by putting ‘pandemic’ in scare quotes, is because, firstly, I draw the line where the WHO used to in its pre-Covid definition of pandemic, as an enormous number of deaths and illness,6 which is to say an event which, by virtue of its enormity, is visible, which can be verified by the senses. Secondly, because I am not interested in arguing with people who don’t access reality through their senses.

Continued...

https://expressiveegg.substack.com/p/i-remember-a-pandemic?utm_source=post-email-title&publication_id=1199056&post_id=145452229&utm_campaign=email-post-title&isFreemail=true&r=228gpv&triedRedirect=true&utm_medium=email

Darren Allen? Dave Allen, surely? nm

Posted by Der <iframe src='https://members5.boardhost.com/xxxxx/info/user=Der' width='330' height='300' border=0 style='border:none;'> on June 13, 2024, 5:43 pm, in reply to "Darren Allen on what occurred between 2020 and 2022"

Insightful contribution from you as usual, Der, thanks for that. nm

Posted by Fionn <iframe src='https://members5.boardhost.com/xxxxx/info/user=Fionn' width='330' height='300' border=0 style='border:none;'> on June 13, 2024, 7:15 pm, in reply to "Darren Allen? Dave Allen, surely? nm"

Well, when I saw your "I'll just leave this here..."

Posted by Der <iframe src='https://members5.boardhost.com/xxxxx/info/user=Der' width='330' height='300' border=0 style='border:none;'> on June 13, 2024, 7:57 pm, in reply to "Insightful contribution from you as usual, Der, thanks for that. nm"

I was initially reminded of Umberto Eco's Prague Cemetery:

"During times of barbarian invasion, the Germanic hordes strewed their route with great masses of faecal material. Even in recent centuries, French travellers knew immediately when they had crossed the Alsace frontier by the abnormal size of the turds left lying along the roads."

Re: Well, when I saw your "I'll just leave this here..."

Posted by Fionn <iframe src='https://members5.boardhost.com/xxxxx/info/user=Fionn' width='330' height='300' border=0 style='border:none;'> on June 13, 2024, 8:40 pm, in reply to "Well, when I saw your "I'll just leave this here...""

How clever. Ironic though, given the volume of your substance-free comments littering the board.

I remember ..

Posted by Shyaku <iframe src='https://members5.boardhost.com/xxxxx/info/user=Shyaku' width='330' height='300' border=0 style='border:none;'> on June 13, 2024, 7:13 pm, in reply to "Darren Allen on what occurred between 2020 and 2022"

I remember a lot of people, some pretty well financed, making the same assertions over and over and over and over again and getting really, really annoyed when it failed to stop people questioning what they were saying. I remember one of those people, a regular poster here, finally dying of COVID, but hey, according to your article, he was just at an age when people die anyway, so who cares? Funnily enough though, his fellow travelers did seem to care. I can’t figure out how that works - they should have stood by their principles if they had any.

Re: I remember ..

Posted by t <iframe src='https://members5.boardhost.com/xxxxx/info/user=TomskiD' width='330' height='300' border=0 style='border:none;'> on June 13, 2024, 11:20 pm, in reply to "I remember .."

I also remember at the time (it seems so long ago), we had the ONS statistics to guide us that the death toll .. at least in the UK, was extremely unusual. Probably something to do with the UK government's laissez-faire approach in dumping the old people into old peoples homes where covid was rife, a typical administrative f*ck up, in addition to other mistaken, as well as corrupt, policies. In addition, I was never comfortable with mrna vaccine in general, especially in the young population cohort. We were also lucky to have had Dan to report from the covid frontline what was going on in the hospitals. In that sense I think that Darren was not in touch with factual evidence since he hasn't touched on these in his essay. Yes, Rhis, poor sod, didn't make it, despite being convinced he could get through using extraordinarily large doses of vitamin C : / rip etc.

Re: Darren Allen on what occurred between 2020 and 2022

Posted by Ian M <iframe src='https://members5.boardhost.com/xxxxx/info/user=Ian+M' width='330' height='300' border=0 style='border:none;'> on June 13, 2024, 11:34 pm, in reply to "Darren Allen on what occurred between 2020 and 2022"

I remember... contentious debates about most of the points he brings up, so few of which resulted in clear cut answers after loads of aggro, which was frustrating and confusing. Should've 'done my own research' really, and there probably was a degree of cowardice involved in not doing so, or just skimming the surface. Didn't take the mandated jab at least, but not exactly a stellar performance when you only object to something when it touches you personally...

His depiction of the Professional Managerial Class and associated brand of left-ish politics is correct IMO, though again it lands uncomfortably close to home. Why were so many dissenting figures silent over covid and the govt/corporate authoritarianism that ramped up over it? Why did some like Chomsky even collude in it and call for the punishment of those who didn't follow government/pharma diktat? I think they are important questions, and Allen is right to continue bringing them up, as irritating as some may find it.

It goes to the heart of what people view as the correct response to crises or even the best way to run society. Despite so much disillusionment, apathy and mistrust of institutions, I was surprised to see that people were on the whole still looking to the state for solutions to the crisis. Some even started taking TV news seriously! And when the state predictably harnessed the pandemic to advance its own agendas the only real pushback came from the libertarian right. That's a problem, especially going deeper into the age of energy, climate and ecological crises.

Anyway, thanks for posting.

cheers,
I

Tell your story; Ask a question; Interpret generously
http://storybythethroat.wordpress.com/tell-ask-listen/

Re: Darren Allen on what occurred between 2020 and 2022

Posted by Ken Waldron <iframe src='https://members5.boardhost.com/xxxxx/info/user=Ken+Waldron' width='330' height='300' border=0 style='border:none;'> on June 14, 2024, 12:28 am, in reply to "Re: Darren Allen on what occurred between 2020 and 2022"

"hospitals were so empty staff could spend their time making amusing dance videos..."

Oh yes...That's what I remember too...when it was reported that:

Pressure on hospitals was at "..a really dangerous point"

In 2020, well it was obviously because there wasn't enough room or all the dancing staff, right?
-What a bullshitter. There's a lot of fucked up "memories" about.

Re: Darren Allen on what occurred between 2020 and 2022

Posted by Itchy Bootmore <iframe src='https://members5.boardhost.com/xxxxx/info/user=Itchy+Bootmore' width='330' height='300' border=0 style='border:none;'> on June 14, 2024, 8:33 am, in reply to "Re: Darren Allen on what occurred between 2020 and 2022"

Thanks Fionn. I too remember most of the points that he covers. I was in fact in our local hospital several times during the 2020 and 2021 Covid era with different very painful acute conditions, including an operation. I can tell you that the A&E was in fact empty every time I went in there. I can tell that when I went to other parts of the hospital that was also empty. I can tell you I went past corridors of prepared but empty & silent wards. Several times. My wife attended hospital for her conditions during the same period and has quite remarkable photos of completely empty departments.

As far as the Statistics go, at the time I downloaded the Excel spreadsheets from ONS for excess deaths, plus the NHS bed use. From what I recall there's no significant observable deviations from normal, certainly within standard deviation territory. I haven't looked at them for a long time.

I also seem to recall Matt Hancock had to account for for the massive increase (reportedly 1000% if I recall?) in Midazolam use, but I haven't seen any such account.

Make of that what you will.

People were too scared to go to A&E, probably.

Posted by Der <iframe src='https://members5.boardhost.com/xxxxx/info/user=Der' width='330' height='300' border=0 style='border:none;'> on June 14, 2024, 10:33 am, in reply to "Re: Darren Allen on what occurred between 2020 and 2022"

I certainly was. I chopped off a portion of the top of my finger and was told over the phone by my GP to go to A&E - I refused. I dealt with it as best I could at home.

On another occasion I tore off my big toe nail. Same result.

I also had an operation due at this time - I postponed it.

I also happened to be in hospital for colon cancer when Covid first arrived and the wards I was in (I was moved around) were packed. We were all masked up.

We all have stories to tell. Make of them what you will.

Re: People were too scared to go to A&E, probably.

Posted by Keith-264 <iframe src='https://members5.boardhost.com/xxxxx/info/user=Keith-264' width='330' height='300' border=0 style='border:none;'> on June 14, 2024, 12:15 pm, in reply to "People were too scared to go to A&E, probably."

Glad you're still here.

The last working-class hero in England.

Clio the cat, ? July 1997 - 1 May 2016
Kira the cat, ? ? 2010 - 3 August 2018
Jasper the Ruffian cat ? ? ? - 4 November 2021

Cheers, K. 😀. nm

Posted by Der <iframe src='https://members5.boardhost.com/xxxxx/info/user=Der' width='330' height='300' border=0 style='border:none;'> on June 14, 2024, 10:37 pm, in reply to "Re: People were too scared to go to A&E, probably."

Re: Darren Allen on what occurred between 2020 and 2022

Posted by Fionn <iframe src='https://members5.boardhost.com/xxxxx/info/user=Fionn' width='330' height='300' border=0 style='border:none;'> on June 14, 2024, 10:41 am, in reply to "Re: Darren Allen on what occurred between 2020 and 2022"

That's interesting, Itchy. It's experiences like yours that are severely censored and taboo in mainstream discourse around what happened (which many who should know better strangely consider gospel on the subject). It's likely the experience of the majority whether they remember it or not.

On a personal note, a friend of our family died of Covid but had serious underlying health complications already. Another friend of mine who was struggling with alcohol addiction in Germany killed himself due to severe lockdown there (his AA meetings shut down) leaving a wife and 3 small children behind. Out of these 2 cases only one is deemed a victim and worthy of sympathy in the official narrative.

As many booster shots of little explanations as deemed necessary ,..

Posted by Shyaku <iframe src='https://members5.boardhost.com/xxxxx/info/user=Shyaku' width='330' height='300' border=0 style='border:none;'> on June 14, 2024, 6:16 pm, in reply to "Re: Darren Allen on what occurred between 2020 and 2022"

It is been a disaster for your mental health to have to stay at home for a while as a pretty standard public health measure, and at the same time, now, everyone with a job has tried to negotiate the right to work 2 days a week from home after the pandemic?

There is probably (doubtless) a smooth and well-coiffed explanation that I am missing that will be explained to me in simple terms as many times as I need to be boosted with it, and its definitely not cognitive dissonance on my part.

Re: Darren Allen on what occurred between 2020 and 2022

Posted by Ken Waldron <iframe src='https://members5.boardhost.com/xxxxx/info/user=Ken+Waldron' width='330' height='300' border=0 style='border:none;'> on June 14, 2024, 2:00 pm, in reply to "Re: Darren Allen on what occurred between 2020 and 2022"

"Make of that what you will."

-The retrospective triumph of anecdote over fact. Here's what happened in little over month:

Number of acute hospital beds in each NHS region occupied by COVID-19 patients on 1 December 2020 and 12 January 2021

https://www.cqc.org.uk/publications/major-reports/covid-19-insight-7-hospital-bed-occupancy-designated-settings

We were all petty much aware here of what was happening at the time and indeed Dan helped keep us informed as to what was going on at the hospital work face. You can look it all up in the archives.
As I recall the most adamant believer that it was "all a hoax" and who refused any innoculation was Rhisiart and indeed he was the only individual known to me from here who probably died of Covid complications: though not before apparently recanting his previous views on Covid as quite mistaken.

I'm a little bit puzzled by this diagram

Posted by SueC <iframe src='https://members5.boardhost.com/xxxxx/info/user=SueC' width='330' height='300' border=0 style='border:none;'> on June 14, 2024, 3:50 pm, in reply to "Re: Darren Allen on what occurred between 2020 and 2022"

The main message of this diagram - at least to my eyes - is that it highlights wide regional differences in bed occupancy due to Covid. I've only cursorily glanced at the linked site but it seems to be primarily focused on 'designated areas' which are for those - almost overwhelmingly people over 65 - being discharged to care homes or who need on-going social support after leaving hospital. So is the diagram for total bed occupancy for all age groups or for those over 65 who were most heavily affected by Covid?

The narrative accompanying the diagram says this "The average COVID-19 occupancy rate was 27% in the seven days to 12 January, compared with 22% in the previous seven days. Two trusts currently have rates above 50%; more than half of their beds are occupied by patients with confirmed COVID-19.

So, on average, a little over one quarter of beds were occupied by Covid patients - I wonder how this compares with other respiratory conditions during a 'normal' year? Didn't 'flu cases decline dramatically during the main year of Covid?

There's still a good deal of animosity and acrimony on this site around what happened in the Covid era. I don't think it's a binary choice; it's possible to hold more than one thought at a time in our heads. I've no doubt that Covid was real and dangerous for some people. I also believe that the supposed mitigation regime imposed on us was totally disproportionate to the risks and was known to be so by many of those doing the imposing. It was highly destructive of the lives, health and well-being of a huge number of people. They shouldn't be ignored.

Re: I'm a little bit puzzled by this diagram

Posted by RaskolnikovX <iframe src='https://members5.boardhost.com/xxxxx/info/user=Raskolnikov' width='330' height='300' border=0 style='border:none;'> on June 14, 2024, 3:56 pm, in reply to "I'm a little bit puzzled by this diagram"

Those regional differences look like they will map pretty well to population/population density.

...no amount of cajolery, and no attempts at ethical or social seduction, can eradicate from my heart a deep burning hatred for the Tory Party...So far as I am concerned they are lower than vermin.

Re: I'm a little bit puzzled by this diagram

Posted by RaskolnikovX <iframe src='https://members5.boardhost.com/xxxxx/info/user=Raskolnikov' width='330' height='300' border=0 style='border:none;'> on June 14, 2024, 4:06 pm, in reply to "Re: I'm a little bit puzzled by this diagram"

...no amount of cajolery, and no attempts at ethical or social seduction, can eradicate from my heart a deep burning hatred for the Tory Party...So far as I am concerned they are lower than vermin.

Re: I'm a little bit puzzled by this diagram

Posted by Ken Waldron <iframe src='https://members5.boardhost.com/xxxxx/info/user=Ken+Waldron' width='330' height='300' border=0 style='border:none;'> on June 14, 2024, 5:15 pm, in reply to "I'm a little bit puzzled by this diagram"

"The main message of this diagram - at least to my eyes - is that it highlights wide regional differences in bed occupancy due to Covid..."

-Posted to show the overall rise in acute cases hospitalised over a six week period which in some regions doubled, tripled, or in London went up over 400%.

But of course if people prefer or pretend to believe that this never really happened and that the nurses were indeed all dancing around empty beds and then reciting anecdotes to back these assertions then factual data such as the above generaly mean nothing to them.

As the immortal Loudon Wainright III once asserted (whilst on Acid): "...Water cures Cancer..." some like Prince Charles might even believe that...but maybe not.

Re: I'm a little bit puzzled by this diagram

Posted by Mark Doran <iframe src='https://members5.boardhost.com/xxxxx/info/user=Mark+Doran+66' width='330' height='300' border=0 style='border:none;'> on June 16, 2024, 7:06 pm, in reply to "Re: I'm a little bit puzzled by this diagram"

"... if people prefer or pretend to believe that this never really happened and that the nurses were indeed all dancing around empty beds..."

https://markdoran.wordpress.com/2021/04/24/normal-country-7/

M.

Re: I'm a little bit puzzled by this diagram

Posted by Ken Waldron <iframe src='https://members5.boardhost.com/xxxxx/info/user=Ken+Waldron' width='330' height='300' border=0 style='border:none;'> on June 16, 2024, 8:18 pm, in reply to "Re: I'm a little bit puzzled by this diagram"

Your mask comment also came to mind recently:

"...Stop pretending that rationality has any part in motivating the anti-mask crusade. This is entirely an issue of fruitcake libertarians having ego-boundary problems."

Re: Darren Allen on what occurred between 2020 and 2022

Posted by Fionn <iframe src='https://members5.boardhost.com/xxxxx/info/user=Fionn' width='330' height='300' border=0 style='border:none;'> on June 14, 2024, 9:24 pm, in reply to "Re: Darren Allen on what occurred between 2020 and 2022"

As you know, although generally healthy, Rhis was well into his 80s (maybe even 90s, I can't remember). He may have recanted his opinions somewhat on the severity of the virus given his first-hand experience but he never advocated putting the unvaccinated in concentration camps like Chomsky did.

Re: Darren Allen on what occurred between 2020 and 2022

Posted by Ken Waldron <iframe src='https://members5.boardhost.com/xxxxx/info/user=Ken+Waldron' width='330' height='300' border=0 style='border:none;'> on June 14, 2024, 10:17 pm, in reply to "Re: Darren Allen on what occurred between 2020 and 2022"

"... he never advocated putting the unvaccinated in concentration camps like Chomsky did. "

That's untrue. I disagreed with his views on the subject but Chomsky said the unvaccinated should "...remove themselves from society" : not be removed by others nor indeed incarcerated.

-I have never seen it reported anywhere that he advocated the unvaccinated should be placed in concentration camps: it's so absurd that I'm going to assume you made that one up yourself.

Re: Darren Allen on what occurred between 2020 and 2022

Posted by Fionn <iframe src='https://members5.boardhost.com/xxxxx/info/user=Fionn' width='330' height='300' border=0 style='border:none;'> on June 14, 2024, 11:25 pm, in reply to "Re: Darren Allen on what occurred between 2020 and 2022"

From the horse's mouth:

"People who refuse to accept vaccines, I think the right response for them is not to force them to but rather to insist that they be isolated."

Not to get into the semantics of this but when the State 'insist' you do something like the Godfather making an offer you can't refuse, we both know that's one and the same as 'force'. Bodily autonomy thrown out the window at the drop of a hat because poor wee Noam became frightened and bought into the lie that an experimental gene-therapy vaccine would stop people from spreading and contracting the virus with zero scientific proof. The thought never entered his head that the only people who might 'isolate' were those who were at most at risk.

As if things weren't made difficult enough for those who chose not go take the jab without him, the revered 'radical' he is, throwing his hat in the ring and spouting establishment bullshit. For all the good he did, it was equivalent for calling for people to be thrown in camps. All it did was show his true colours and how detached he is. And this is coming from someone who deeply respected and admired his work for many years before his critical faculties began to break down!

Re: Darren Allen on what occurred between 2020 and 2022

Posted by Ken Waldron <iframe src='https://members5.boardhost.com/xxxxx/info/user=Ken+Waldron' width='330' height='300' border=0 style='border:none;'> on June 15, 2024, 12:06 am, in reply to "Re: Darren Allen on what occurred between 2020 and 2022"

-I certainly think that he was not on his game any more: his earlier stance on Syria was a major give away and I agree with you that it would have been best "that the only people who might 'isolate' were those who were at most at risk."

But as to:

"...Not to get into the semantics of this but when the State 'insist' you do something like the Godfather..."

-On the " horses mouth" you should note he didn't mention the state. He said:"... the right response... is not to force them" : which by any reading precludes forced action by state powers...and accords with his expressed view that they "...remove themselves from society"

By no stretch of the imagination can his admitted vagueness on an accomodation be made to be the "...equivalent for calling for people to be thrown in camps. " or indeed him advocating the unvaccinated be placed "Concentration camps".

Re: Darren Allen on what occurred between 2020 and 2022

Posted by Fionn <iframe src='https://members5.boardhost.com/xxxxx/info/user=Fionn' width='330' height='300' border=0 style='border:none;'> on June 15, 2024, 10:20 am, in reply to "Re: Darren Allen on what occurred between 2020 and 2022"

By no stretch of the imagination

He said insist. Who'd do the insisting and how would it be done? It's not a huge leap in the imagination to see where this authoritarian thinking leads.

Re: Darren Allen on what occurred between 2020 and 2022

Posted by Keith-264 <iframe src='https://members5.boardhost.com/xxxxx/info/user=Keith-264' width='330' height='300' border=0 style='border:none;'> on June 15, 2024, 11:05 am, in reply to "Re: Darren Allen on what occurred between 2020 and 2022"

How many people are still taking the vaccines and boosters?

The last working-class hero in England.

Clio the cat, ? July 1997 - 1 May 2016
Kira the cat, ? ? 2010 - 3 August 2018
Jasper the Ruffian cat ? ? ? - 4 November 2021

Re: Darren Allen on what occurred between 2020 and 2022

Posted by Ken Waldron <iframe src='https://members5.boardhost.com/xxxxx/info/user=Ken+Waldron' width='330' height='300' border=0 style='border:none;'> on June 15, 2024, 12:22 pm, in reply to "Re: Darren Allen on what occurred between 2020 and 2022"

"He said insist"

-Yea...he did: not "forced".

Extrapolating from the word "insist" to claim he actually meant that the state should force people into concentration camps is simply not a tenable construction.

Your claim in unevidenced.

Re: Darren Allen on what occurred between 2020 and 2022

Posted by Fionn <iframe src='https://members5.boardhost.com/xxxxx/info/user=Fionn' width='330' height='300' border=0 style='border:none;'> on June 14, 2024, 10:29 am, in reply to "Re: Darren Allen on what occurred between 2020 and 2022"

Nicely put, Ian. I too look back and question my own attitude during that time and how slow I was to realise what was really happening. Doesn't bode well for the future when so many 'radicals' obediently get in line if they're sufficiently frightened/confused, and suddenly look to the government as some sort of moral/'scientific' authority. The Gangsters-in-charge are surely rubbing their hands with glee when thinking of the multiple crisis to come and how profitable it will be to herd the population in certain directions favourable to their desired outcomes.

Re: Darren Allen on what occurred between 2020 and 2022

Posted by Keith-264 <iframe src='https://members5.boardhost.com/xxxxx/info/user=Keith-264' width='330' height='300' border=0 style='border:none;'> on June 14, 2024, 12:17 pm, in reply to "Re: Darren Allen on what occurred between 2020 and 2022"

I had the benefit of Dan's opinion, which I was willing to go along with.

The last working-class hero in England.

Clio the cat, ? July 1997 - 1 May 2016
Kira the cat, ? ? 2010 - 3 August 2018
Jasper the Ruffian cat ? ? ? - 4 November 2021

Re: Darren Allen on what occurred between 2020 and 2022

Posted by Ian M <iframe src='https://members5.boardhost.com/xxxxx/info/user=Ian+M' width='330' height='300' border=0 style='border:none;'> on June 14, 2024, 7:30 pm, in reply to "Re: Darren Allen on what occurred between 2020 and 2022"

Thanks Fionn,

'The Gangsters-in-charge are surely rubbing their hands with glee when thinking of the multiple crisis to come and how profitable it will be to herd the population in certain directions favourable to their desired outcomes.'

Indeed, hence the keen interest by western intel agencies in what Israel is doing to Palestinians in Gaza - you never know when it might come in handy to move a terrorised population from place to place based on some barely plausible excuse because you want the land they're on or just want them gone for some reason.

On the other hand, they might have overplayed their hand and the next pandemic that comes around with a high fatality rate could see public control measures widely ignored because of peoples' memories of how the last one was 'managed'. No doubt it will be conspiracy theorists, antisemites and fascists deemed responsible for the resulting deaths, not the institutions that undermined public trust past breaking point.

Btw I have some sympathy for the argument that a state-led response to crises is the best possible outcome given the current circumstances. People make the same point with climate change, eg: Roger Hallam:

If that's the only realistic alternative to market fundamentalism or corporate fascism (to the extent that the two are different during times of crisis) then it makes sense if you're up against it to push for the best possible decision-making from existing leadership, no matter how corrupt and insane they've shown themselves to be. I'd only say that people shouldn't kid themselves that this would represent a positive step towards the kind of world we want to live in, with state societies magically transforming into engines of public good rather than organisations that emerged precisely to serve the interests of centralised power & control which are the cause of nearly all the ills that we face.

I think a lot of liberal-left types saw covid as an opportunity in this way, and were happy to support sweeping measures taken by the government in the name of safety & security, because that is their preferred form of governance. A managerial class, or at least aspiring to be as Allen points out. And if it f*s over the working class and transfers their remaining wealth and assets to a handful of billionaires, too bad. They want the same response to climate change too, and the battle lines have already been drawn with in many cases the same covid skeptics opposing any govt-led restriction in the name of climate change because "it's all a ploy to take away our freedoms", and "it's not real anyway" etc etc. Meanwhile the PMC's will be supportive of anything that says 'net zero' in it no matter how crazy or damaging it proves to be, because "something has to be done", and "it's a bitter pill but we have to swallow it" (ie: we have to force you to swallow it). Both positions have some truth to them, but are also fundamentally flawed. Almost like they're being played against eachother in a game of divide and rule... It's not going to end well.

cheers,
I

Tell your story; Ask a question; Interpret generously
http://storybythethroat.wordpress.com/tell-ask-listen/

Re: Darren Allen on what occurred between 2020 and 2022

Posted by Fionn <iframe src='https://members5.boardhost.com/xxxxx/info/user=Fionn' width='330' height='300' border=0 style='border:none;'> on June 15, 2024, 5:50 pm, in reply to "Re: Darren Allen on what occurred between 2020 and 2022"

Indeed, hence the keen interest by western intel agencies in what Israel is doing to Palestinians in Gaza - you never know when it might come in handy to move a terrorised population from place to place based on some barely plausible excuse because you want the land they're on or just want them gone for some reason.

Yes, for most, it hasn't sunk in that the Empire will inevitably come home one day and wreak the same havoc as it did abroad. The ruling classes see us in the same light as Palestinians, whose fate they're completely indifferent to, except when it profits them. Their psychopathy is exposed for all to see in their support for the Gaza genocide but all they have to do for people to forget this (if they even remembered in the first place) is engineer another crisis and present themselves as saviours.

The divide and rule psyops are sophisticated and being constantly refined after decades/centuries of practice. Throw AI into the mix and we really are in for a fun ride. For me one of the most horrifying aspects of events in the past few decades has been the cynical co-opting of the environmental movement, bringing shallow green discourse into the mainstream to serve private interests and of course fermenting a reaction against much needed genuine action because people lump it in with the phoney 'green' agenda from the hypocrites in power who continue business as usual at full throttle towards the cliff edge. As you know, 'Leftists' should be up in arms about this and the dominant economic growth paradigm but are still too conditioned, docile and I hate to use DA's word here but he's right, cowardly.

Why do we have to revisit this shit again?

Posted by Shyaku <iframe src='https://members5.boardhost.com/xxxxx/info/user=Shyaku' width='330' height='300' border=0 style='border:none;'> on June 14, 2024, 6:08 pm, in reply to "Darren Allen on what occurred between 2020 and 2022"

I remember Dan patiently keeping this board together despite people basically implying he was a liar for seeing what he was seeing, and doing what he was doing, every day in real time in a respiratory intensive care ICU.

His ICU patients did not do so well in general, but his other patient (this board) survived - so why do we have to revisit this shit again?

Re: Why do we have to revisit this shit again?

Posted by Keith-264 <iframe src='https://members5.boardhost.com/xxxxx/info/user=Keith-264' width='330' height='300' border=0 style='border:none;'> on June 14, 2024, 6:24 pm, in reply to "Why do we have to revisit this shit again?"

He got a dose of it as well; his account of riding to work and being put to bed was quite alarming.

The last working-class hero in England.

Clio the cat, ? July 1997 - 1 May 2016
Kira the cat, ? ? 2010 - 3 August 2018
Jasper the Ruffian cat ? ? ? - 4 November 2021

Psyching myself up for the re-release of Dr Vernon Coleman's Greatest Hits...

Posted by Ken Waldron <iframe src='https://members5.boardhost.com/xxxxx/info/user=Ken+Waldron' width='330' height='300' border=0 style='border:none;'> on June 14, 2024, 6:47 pm, in reply to "Why do we have to revisit this shit again?"

-Cos the old ones are the best ones.

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