Re: Not sure that Waters suing Polly Samson is a good idea. - he'd likely loose. Archived Message
Posted by John Monro on February 7, 2023, 7:36 pm, in reply to "Re: Indy...wife of David Gilmour, accuses Roger Waters of ‘antisemitism to your rotten core’"
I'm not sure suing for libel is a good idea. The definition of anti-Semtism now is so loose and nebulous, it would be pretty easy to examine everything that Waters has ever said or ever written, take it out of context, and make it appear antisemitic. Polly only has to prove her case on the balance of probabilities. There may be other aspects of Waters personal life whilst not totally relevant, could be brought out to prove what a nasty or unreasonable man he is. Corbyn was a pioneer victim of such manipulation. Waters is being painted by the media as the villain here, in exactly the same way, so he'll be fighting the establishment, and its friendly judiciary, in the same manner. Doesn't the IHRA's definition of antisemitism, which has unfortunately achieved some international support, include the statement that "drawing comparisons of contemporary Israeli policy to that of the Nazis" is anti-Semitic. Under that definition, then Waters is an anti-Semite. These IHRA rules were adopted by Labour, and used a stick by the media and other parties to beat down Corbyn, and we know that anyone now criticising Israel in work or academia risks losing their jobs. Slander/libel laws in the UK are a minefield. and he could end up paying millions for no purpose at all. Interesting though in the US this particularly troublesome use of the IHRA's definitions of anti-Semitism has seen the American Bar Association remove these more troublesome "rules" from a forthcoming resolution on anti-Semitism, on the grounds it restricts free-speech. Various Jewish "advocates" (who?) are disappointed by this, denying this interpretation restricts free speech. but it has certainly been used informally by political opponents and by Israel's all-too-effective propaganda machine and lobby to batter critics of Israel to shut up or withdraw. https://www.washingtonexaminer.com/policy/courts/jewish-groups-lament-aba-ditching-recognized-antisemitism-definition I should add that in any context it is generally unwise to use the label "NAZI" on any one or organisation you're criticising. Listen to Mercouris, he is very careful to avoid using the word, he used to be a very successful barrister. Nazism was peculiar to Germany in the 19303 and 1940s. It is an mistake to label Israel as NAZI, even if the comparisons might be there, for instance, the situation of the Palestinians in Gaza as compared to the Warsaw Ghetto. . Exceptions though are sound and can be made for certain organisations and individuals in Ukraine, who make no secret of their own regard to NAZI history and ideology and similarly the many far-right wing, white supremacist and anti-Semitic organisations and gangs in many countries in Europe, the USA, South America and elsewhere. Here is it is reasonable and rational to call a spade a spade. Less contentious in in regard to Israel is to point to its fascist tendencies, as confirmed by left-wing Israeli critics in that country or overseas, , or to particular politicians such as Itamar Ben-Gvir. and others, apparently called Kahanists (I am not that knowledgeable about this political ideology) Equally Waters is on safer ground in labelling the Israeli state as "apartheid", he has the backing of Amenesty International and the Human Rights Watch. Though we now hear that Amnesty International is itself anti-Semitic, as Josep Borrell , the EU "foreign affairs spokesman" has just stated that it is anti-Semitic to call the Israeli state an apartheid state, he said this in criticising Amnesty International https://newcoldwar.org/eu-says-its-anti-semitic-to-call-israel-an-apartheid-state/ .
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Message Thread:
- Indy...wife of David Gilmour, accuses Roger Waters of ‘antisemitism to your rotten core’ - sinister burt February 7, 2023, 12:13 pm
- Re: Indy...wife of David Gilmour, accuses Roger Waters of ‘antisemitism to your rotten core’ - Gerard February 7, 2023, 12:19 pm
- Full interview transcript of Waters' interview with Berliner Zeitung - johnlilburne February 7, 2023, 2:41 pm
- Re: Indy...wife of David Gilmour, accuses Roger Waters of ‘antisemitism to your rotten core’ - johnlilburne February 7, 2023, 2:48 pm
- Re: Indy...wife of David Gilmour, accuses Roger Waters of ‘antisemitism to your rotten core’ - Dovetail Joint February 7, 2023, 3:36 pm
- Re: Not sure that Waters suing Polly Samson is a good idea. - he'd likely loose. - John Monro February 7, 2023, 7:36 pm
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