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The death of Corbynism

Posted by Adamski <iframe src='https://members5.boardhost.com/xxxxx/info/user=Adamski' width='330' height='300' border=0 style='border:none;'> on July 25, 2025, 7:36 am

Tru dat.

?si=hL30eocOyaTa_UqN

Re: The death of Corbynism

Posted by Adamski <iframe src='https://members5.boardhost.com/xxxxx/info/user=Adamski' width='330' height='300' border=0 style='border:none;'> on July 25, 2025, 8:07 am, in reply to "The death of Corbynism"

Dead end death whatever

Re: The death of Corbynism

Posted by johnlilburne <iframe src='https://members5.boardhost.com/xxxxx/info/user=johnlilburne' width='330' height='300' border=0 style='border:none;'> on July 25, 2025, 11:24 am, in reply to "The death of Corbynism"

It can easily be agreed that this latest Corbynist attempt to revive social democracy is doomed to failure.

We can acknowledge Corbyn's manifest inadequacies as a leader, his lack of political nous, his naive attempt to appease the Zionist right, even his betrayal of his core supporters.

But, some of the visceral hatred directed towards him is almost pathological. A lot of it feels like projection.

What is this guy's solution? Mobilise the working class for revolution? There is hardly any organised working class left to speak of in the UK.

If you are going to mobilise the masses you need to educate them. Middle class Marxists handing out esoteric tracts does not really fit the bill.

BTW, if I remember rightly, Stalin went a little further than merely throwing his comrades under the bus.

Re: The death of Corbynism

Posted by t <iframe src='https://members5.boardhost.com/xxxxx/info/user=TomskiD' width='330' height='300' border=0 style='border:none;'> on July 25, 2025, 11:51 am, in reply to "Re: The death of Corbynism"

BTW, if I remember rightly, Stalin went a little further than merely throwing his comrades under the bus.

Do you mean the 27 million Soviets by the time he got to Berlin?

Re: The death of Corbynism

Posted by johnlilburne <iframe src='https://members5.boardhost.com/xxxxx/info/user=johnlilburne' width='330' height='300' border=0 style='border:none;'> on July 25, 2025, 12:22 pm, in reply to "Re: The death of Corbynism"

No, I meant the comrades liquidated in the purges.

I don't know if it was strictly necessary for so many 'Soviets' to be sacrificed to defeat the Nazis.

Re: The death of Corbynism

Posted by t <iframe src='https://members5.boardhost.com/xxxxx/info/user=TomskiD' width='330' height='300' border=0 style='border:none;'> on July 25, 2025, 12:40 pm, in reply to "Re: The death of Corbynism"

No, I meant the comrades liquidated in the purges.

I know, I was being mischievous ..

I don't know if it was strictly necessary for so many 'Soviets' to be sacrificed to defeat the Nazis.

19 out of 27 million were civilians. Sacrificed?

Re: The death of Corbynism

Posted by Keith-264 <iframe src='https://members5.boardhost.com/xxxxx/info/user=Keith-264' width='330' height='300' border=0 style='border:none;'> on July 25, 2025, 1:45 pm, in reply to "Re: The death of Corbynism"

The best of the Red Army died in the 1941 campaign that sealed Germany's fate. Fighting the Germans after that was more expensive because the post-1941 Red Army was like the BEF after the pre-war regulars died in 1914 and 1915 so the 1916 army had to learn from scratch against some of the best-trained troops in the German army. Statistically Soviet losses declined after 1941 but were still astronomical. The British and US had it easy (by comparison) yet suffered the worst of their losses from June 1944 to May 1945.

The last working-class hero in England.
Clio the cat, ? July 1997 - 1 May 2016
Kira the cat, ? ? 2010 - 3 August 2018
Jasper the Ruffian cat ??? - 4 November 2021
Georgina the cat ???-4 December 2025

Re: The death of Corbynism

Posted by Keith-264 <iframe src='https://members5.boardhost.com/xxxxx/info/user=Keith-264' width='330' height='300' border=0 style='border:none;'> on July 25, 2025, 1:41 pm, in reply to "Re: The death of Corbynism"

Some of the visceral hatred directed towards him is almost pathological. A lot of it feels like projection.

Come off it, you're making excuses for a man who failed so comprehensively that he might as well have set out to do this all along; even Syriza weren't this bad.

The last working-class hero in England.
Clio the cat, ? July 1997 - 1 May 2016
Kira the cat, ? ? 2010 - 3 August 2018
Jasper the Ruffian cat ??? - 4 November 2021
Georgina the cat ???-4 December 2025

Re: The death of Corbynism

Posted by Adamski <iframe src='https://members5.boardhost.com/xxxxx/info/user=Adamski' width='330' height='300' border=0 style='border:none;'> on July 26, 2025, 3:45 am, in reply to "Re: The death of Corbynism"

Good point about need for re- education. On the other bit, we hate the pretenders the worst who say they can help

A joker.

Posted by Ken Waldron <iframe src='https://members5.boardhost.com/xxxxx/info/user=Ken+Waldron' width='330' height='300' border=0 style='border:none;'> on July 25, 2025, 12:13 pm, in reply to "The death of Corbynism"

If its no longer historically possible to wring a few shoddy concessions for Social Democracy because post war material wealth is gone and the organisational leverage to extract them simply no longer exists ...then, under the same conditions, how the feck are you going to get to the "Dictatorship of the Proletariat" ?

The guy is even more of an anachronism than Corbyn.

Re: A joker.

Posted by johnlilburne <iframe src='https://members5.boardhost.com/xxxxx/info/user=johnlilburne' width='330' height='300' border=0 style='border:none;'> on July 25, 2025, 12:26 pm, in reply to "A joker. "

The guy is even more of an anachronism than Corbyn.

Tend to agree. The fantasy of proletarian revolution is dead in the age of collapse.

Re: A joker.

Posted by Keith-264 <iframe src='https://members5.boardhost.com/xxxxx/info/user=Keith-264' width='330' height='300' border=0 style='border:none;'> on July 25, 2025, 1:51 pm, in reply to "Re: A joker. "

Economic contraction is creating a situation in which the the middle-class bumfluff is facing the same immiseration already inflicted on the working class. The first steps in the robbery of even more of the pension rights of even more people have been taken.

The last working-class hero in England.
Clio the cat, ? July 1997 - 1 May 2016
Kira the cat, ? ? 2010 - 3 August 2018
Jasper the Ruffian cat ??? - 4 November 2021
Georgina the cat ???-4 December 2025

Re: A joker.

Posted by Adamski <iframe src='https://members5.boardhost.com/xxxxx/info/user=Adamski' width='330' height='300' border=0 style='border:none;'> on July 26, 2025, 3:41 am, in reply to "Re: A joker. "

"Tend to agree. The fantasy of proletarian revolution is dead in the age of collapse."

Yet the ruling class are terrified of such an event so they arrest, bankrupt, imprison, cheat and kill to prevent this

Maybe bloody listen

Posted by Chris Rogers <iframe src='https://members5.boardhost.com/xxxxx/info/user=Chris+Rogers' width='330' height='300' border=0 style='border:none;'> on July 25, 2025, 4:33 pm, in reply to "The death of Corbynism"

I note Ken and John seem to have major issues with what Alex Mckay is actually saying, given this clip is taken from a far longer PodCast from a few days ago, i.e., no Messiah movement with allegedly 300K signed up members.
For what its worth and the actuality, Mckay is actually negative about the prospects of any working class engagement in British politics, particularly that of a Revolutionary nature, i.e., the dire matial conditions for this just don't exist presently in the Uk and are unlikely to exist until another huge financial crisis, that will make that of 2008/09 seem like a walk in the park.

So, and lets be clear, the Communist Party Great Britain is not pushing Proletarian Revolution given the conditions don't exist for this potential. Indeed, the function of the CMGB presently is educational and engagement with the working class, i.e., we actually drink at Wetherspoon Pubs where a lot of poor, working class peeps hang out and, would you not consider it better for actual Socialists to attempt to reach out to the working class rather than fascists and Farage.

So again, please don't put bollocks into peeps mouths.

By the way, even Craig Murray is slagging off the Messiah and the fecking 'soft-Zionist' cabal he, that is Corbyn, continues to allow to influence him.

Essentially we have re-hashed Corbynism, which, and as Macay correctly states, is a dead end. Oh, and that's before we actually discuss the UK Power Elite, which, will never allow Corbyn and a soft-left Party the keys to Number 10.

Re: Maybe bloody listen

Posted by Ken Waldron <iframe src='https://members5.boardhost.com/xxxxx/info/user=Ken+Waldron' width='330' height='300' border=0 style='border:none;'> on July 25, 2025, 7:24 pm, in reply to "Maybe bloody listen"

Why do people do this to themselves?

"...please don't put bollocks into peeps mouths"
-except you've just admitted what I summarised is indeed the thrust of his position on a new "Corbynist" party...and indeed also informed us that he also recognises my latter point to be true too: if the mild mannered Janitor can't squeeze a few changes out the system then Dave Sparts "Revolutionary Dictatorship of the Proletariat" has got the proverbial snowballs chance in Hell.

Re: Maybe bloody listen

Posted by johnlilburne <iframe src='https://members5.boardhost.com/xxxxx/info/user=johnlilburne' width='330' height='300' border=0 style='border:none;'> on July 25, 2025, 7:54 pm, in reply to "Maybe bloody listen"

the Communist Party Great Britain is not pushing Proletarian Revolution given the conditions don't exist for this potential.

Glad to hear it.

Of course, it's best to reach out to the working class where they are actually at. Which means leaving some of the esoteric Marxist jargon at the pub door.

From great expectations, great disappointment arises ..

Posted by Shyaku <iframe src='https://members5.boardhost.com/xxxxx/info/user=Shyaku' width='330' height='300' border=0 style='border:none;'> on July 26, 2025, 2:11 am, in reply to "The death of Corbynism"

Disappointment arises from overly-elevated expectations ..

Politics is not a religion, you don’t have to believe in it ..

Therefore, can we please try to successfully hold two ideas in our minds at the same time?

(1) We can/must try

(2) It is unlikely to succeed, could be (highly?) flawed

It is attachment to belief that is the problem, perhaps. Going through the motions of trying and failing doesn’t have to result in a loss of faith, since faith itself is maybe the problem here.

The points Keith makes, as a counterpoint to belief in the system, are worthy of far more respect than they are given. I am sometimes shocked at the vitriol that they receive.

Eyethankyou,

Shyaku

You're very kind

Posted by Keith-264 <iframe src='https://members5.boardhost.com/xxxxx/info/user=Keith-264' width='330' height='300' border=0 style='border:none;'> on July 27, 2025, 8:36 pm, in reply to "From great expectations, great disappointment arises .."

I fear that too many of our shipwrecked mariners are waiting for a messiah and don't like being reminded that they are a helpful as a cup of cold sick.

The last working-class hero in England.
Clio the cat, ? July 1997 - 1 May 2016
Kira the cat, ? ? 2010 - 3 August 2018
Jasper the Ruffian cat ??? - 4 November 2021
Georgina the cat ???-4 December 2025

Re: You're very kind

Posted by t <iframe src='https://members5.boardhost.com/xxxxx/info/user=TomskiD' width='330' height='300' border=0 style='border:none;'> on July 28, 2025, 9:45 pm, in reply to "You're very kind"

I fear that too many of our shipwrecked mariners are waiting for a messiah and don't like being reminded that they are a helpful as a cup of cold sick.

Smear away, and yet you offer absolutely zero solution of any kind. I've carefully tested you and you came up short, sorry to say .. so far (except perhaps hoisting a black flag which was a joke as told). Zero .. hold that in your mind .. prove it otherwise hehe

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