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Expensive or not?

Posted by Dave Hill on November 12, 2007, 8:11 pm

Evening all.

Sorry to bore you all with this, but I had a repair bill this morning that left a draft blowing through my wallet, that will take some healing

.

Our Roller Brake Tester failed last week & I called MSI to fix it. I was very impressed by the response time, with an engineer on site within 35 minutes. He diagnosed a faulty handset or cable & returned the next morning with a new one. Job Done!

The labour/call out costs were what I expected, but the cost of the parts just astounded me.

Have a guess at what the charge was for this handset & 5 meters of decent quality cable...........

Cheers

Dave (Hill)

Re: Expensive or not?

Posted by tony bickers on November 12, 2007, 8:13 pm, in reply to "Expensive or not?"
Tony Bickers

£500

Re: Expensive or not?

Posted by Dave Harney on November 12, 2007, 9:45 pm, in reply to "Re: Expensive or not?"
Dave Harney

£350 + vat

Re: Expensive or not?

Posted by george brockis on November 13, 2007, 9:29 am, in reply to "Re: Expensive or not?"

You should try my solicitor. Pick his nose ,sign paper,That will be £500 please. My old Allen HH brake tester 24 years old has a nice old mech switch which i can normally repair with a chewing gum and spit!!GEORGE

Re: Expensive or not?

Posted by Dave Hill on November 13, 2007, 8:12 pm, in reply to "Re: Expensive or not?"

Thanks Fellas

I will ring MSI this morning & tell them that maybe they have undercharged me. It was actually invoiced at £311.16 + vat.

I thought I could count on you lot to back me up! You know who your mates are hey!

Makes you wonder though doesn't it, how they arrive at these prices. That control box has as much technology inside as a musical birthday card (less in fact). I dread to think what a new motor would set me back for the brake roller.

Thanks for the replies

Dave "Tight Wad" (Hill)

Re: Expensive or not?

Posted by Kevin Apps on November 13, 2007, 11:40 pm, in reply to "Re: Expensive or not?"
Kevin Apps

Dave.
I can tell you how much it cost,s to have two brake roller motor,s dryied and tested after being flooded (6 months old) £600 + vat.
Kev.

Re: Expensive or not?

Posted by Barry Rudd on November 14, 2007, 1:19 pm, in reply to "Re: Expensive or not?"
Barry Rudd

My local garage somehow ripped the cable out of theirs--urgent job monday morning-to repair cable, solder and heatshrink to the tiny bits of cable left
30 quid plus VAT
well they dont charge me for an MOT so...
Barry

Re: Expensive or not?

Posted by Tony gould on November 15, 2007, 10:36 am, in reply to "Re: Expensive or not?"
Tony Gould

We upgraded our brake tester in 2003 which included a remote control,had to replace it recently at a cost of £320 including the VAT which was sent to us so no engineers charge.
Might make you feel better?
Regards
Tony

Re: Expensive or not?

Posted by Dave Hill on November 15, 2007, 8:39 pm, in reply to "Re: Expensive or not?"

Hi Tony

Not really mate! Your handset no doubt had some serious technology inside.

My total bill was something like £560 + VAT.

Oh well, new day tomorrow!

Cheers

Re: Expensive or not?

Posted by Harry Anderson on November 16, 2007, 12:57 pm, in reply to "Re: Expensive or not?"
Harry Anderson

Just had my bill for a Bradbury lead light on our ATL quite ordinary except for a rocker switch to control the shaker plate. A mere £425.00 plus VAT.
This is on an installation 13 months old (1 month out of warranty. Since this piece of kit has been installed we have called out MSI 17 times!Luckily we have not fitted it so I shall back it.(The lead light that is)
Harry

Re: Expensive or not?

Posted by Tony Gould on November 16, 2007, 3:17 pm, in reply to "Re: Expensive or not?"
Tony Gould

Hi Harry
Is it a bradbury lift you have had installed as part of your ATL ?, im thinking of buying a large 4 poster and considering a Bradbury 5 tonne.
But concerned if you have had to call out MSI so many times.
From what information im getting about ramps etc,many factors are willing to sell you one then pass over the warranty period to firms such as MSI,of which i fell out with a few years ago and have no faith in them.
Thanks
Tony

Re: Expensive or not?

Posted by Andrew West on November 16, 2007, 11:07 pm, in reply to "Re: Expensive or not?"

My Teclamit lift packed up not long out of warranty & I decided to try finding the fault myself.After quickly working out how to work it manually by pressing the switches with the cover removed,I ordered a new switch from an independant supplier.The switch came without the bits that were faulty & I found out later that it had been superceded.I ended up getting the engineer to come out & replace the switch, which cost an arm & a leg.The next time it went wrong , it was the latching circuit at fault, so I cable tied the latches back, so that I could lower the lift(dangerous I Know).I then proceeded to test for the fault which I was pretty certain was the bridge diode at fault.I called the engineer again, because I had several MOT's to do & needed to get it working.He came out, went through all the checks that I had already performed & eventually came to the same conclusion as I had. So he thought that he would prove the theory, by testing it with a multimeter & found that the replacement part tested the same as the faulty part, but after replacing it, everything worked fine, then I went and did exactly what I was being carefull not to do & cut one of the latch solenoid wires when I was removing the cable ties.
Anyway, what I was getting at is that Tecalemit charged me about £40 for a part that I found a supplier for in france(where the lift was made) selling it for about £1.50. So it may be worth searching the internet for the parts that you need in the future, but the problem usually is that time doesn't permit getting a part that way.
Sorry for the long winded post.
Regards,Andrew

Re: Expensive or not?

Posted by Michael Whitworth on November 17, 2007, 8:06 am, in reply to "Re: Expensive or not?"
Mike Whitworth - Administrator

Hi Andrew,

Your post reads very much like a lot of conversations I have with customers who have diagnosed the fault themselves and can get the parts for a fraction of the cost I am charging him (on the internet).

I have nothing to hide and I can live with what I charge people(which should be more). I just hate having to justify myself to these people so in most cases I don't bother. I ensure every customer is quoted for initial diagnostics and is kept fully aware of costs as the job progresses, if they can get bits on the internet they take the car away, pay me for time spent on job so far and fit their own (cheap) parts.

needless to say few take that option.

Let them get on with their job and you get on with yours, you will earn more money that way with less grief.

Mike

Re: Expensive or not?

Posted by Andrew West on November 19, 2007, 10:00 pm, in reply to "Re: Expensive or not?"
Andrew West

Hello Michael,
I found it quicker & cheaper to find the fault myself & be able to carry on using the lift, until the repair chap could come with some spare parts.I have found that so far when the engineer comes he is quite similar to car dealer workshop technicians,where he keeps fitting replacement parts instead of actually diagnosing the fault properly.
I considered myself more capable of finding the fault than the engineer(not meaning to sound big headed), but the main reason for my post was to just state the riduculous variation in prices for the exact same part, with the ones I found coming from a dealer in France & the part supplied from Tecalemit coming straight from the factory.
I understand your point of view & also get fed up with customers wanting to supply cheaper parts, but usually the parts that they are sourcing are not the same make or quality.
Ps with the first repair of the lift when the switch was faulty, I was using the lift manually for ages, as after having the wrong incomplete switch sent from the source that I found,Tecalemit supplied exactly the same, incomplete switch & the engineer ended up using a switch from a "spare" control box that he happened to have.
Kind regards,Andrew

Re: Expensive or not?

Posted by Tom Williams on November 20, 2007, 9:43 am, in reply to "Re: Expensive or not?"
Tom Williams

Hi all,

Over the past 35yrs or so we have had many visits from equipment manufacturers' site engineers. I would agree with the previous post, the majority have very little in the way of diagnostic skills. They mainly rely on swapping parts. The brake tester mechanic from one major supplier even had to borrow tools from us nearly every time he came. I try to do my own replacements where I can. Some consumables like batteries are priced to give profit in the order of 3-400%. Think how well we would do if we sold car batteries at that mark up.

TW

Re: Expensive or not?

Posted by Harry Anderson on November 20, 2007, 11:44 am, in reply to "Re: Expensive or not?"

Hi Tony
Yes ,it is.Most of our on going problems concern the brake roller tester.Apparently not installed correctly (their engineer). But only detected after the expiration of the warranty.

I will try and put my fault log for that setup up onto the site.
As you can see from this the only replacement parts that were required occurred out of warranty. Looking at the log you can see that there were problems with these items during the warranty period. The column "days" is the time between visits from MSI.
We have been trying to speak to Bradburys rep but we have still not been contacted. Most of the pressure to get them to respond has come from John Went of Unipart who told us yesterday; if we still had not heard by Wednesday next week we should contact him (John Went) again,and, that MSI were part of Stenhoj who also own Bradbury.
I am not suggesting for one moment that the parts replacement was deferred until the warranty had expired,just coincidence I am sure

.

There is another member on here that has a Bradbury ATL but his name escapes me at the moment. In the mean time I shall be attending the Mechanex 2007 and may take a sandwich board and leaflets with me.

Harry

Re: Expensive or not?

Posted by Tony gould on November 20, 2007, 12:20 pm, in reply to "Re: Expensive or not?"
Tony Gould

Thanks Harry
If ok with you i will put your probs to Bradbury/unipart/MSI/Stenhoj when considering purchasing there ramp
Regards Tony

Re: Expensive or not?

Posted by Harry Anderson on November 20, 2007, 12:22 pm, in reply to "Re: Expensive or not?"
Harry Anderson

Hi Tony
No problem with that.
Harry
P.S. did you get the log?

Re: Expensive or not?

Posted by Tony Gould on November 20, 2007, 1:10 pm, in reply to "Re: Expensive or not?"
Tony Gould

Hi Harry
Did not receive your log,Am i right in thinking that you had to pay for repairs although they failed in warranty period.
Tony

Re: Expensive or not?

Posted by Tony gould on November 20, 2007, 2:46 pm, in reply to "Re: Expensive or not?"
Tony Gould

Thanks,now received log,can now see whats,what.please disregard my last message.
Tony

Re: Expensive or not?

Posted by Harry Anderson on November 20, 2007, 3:13 pm, in reply to "Re: Expensive or not?"

Hi Tony
I sent logs to the email "under" your name as excel attachments, they may be in the trash or maybe your email has changed?
All of the parts that required replacement (and charged for) since the expiry were items or related items tended to during the warranty.The parts and labour excluding VAT were; parts 493.33 labour 615.00 ex VAT.
It just surprises me that it should be found they needed replacement after the warranty period.The most persistent of these faults was outside the warranty by two days! If you can get the logs you will see the dates and information taken from the engineers sheets.
Since the expiration of the warranty 58 working days ago it has cost me £1108.33 in repairs and 6-7 hours down time. With a visit average by MSI of once every 26 days my concern is the ongoing cost of ownership of this piece of kit.
From the accountancy point of view maybe we should move it from assets to the liabilities.

Harry

Re: Expensive or not?

Posted by Harry Anderson on November 20, 2007, 3:16 pm, in reply to "Re: Expensive or not?"
Harry Anderson

Too late!!Tis done!!

Re: Expensive or not?

Posted by Harry Anderson on January 16, 2008, 2:15 pm, in reply to "Re: Expensive or not?"

Hi all
Just an update to this thread.
On Saturday passed we had a problem with our brake tester again (this will be visit 33 on a 14 month old piece of kit) and decided that as from Monday we would go deccelerometer,duly notified MSI and the local area office. Monday call back from MSI to say that overdue invoices had to be paid before they would attend,phoned Bradbury`s Andy Maloney Area Sales Manager,left message on voice mail as to why,after following his instruction not to pay Bradbury`s sister company MSI we were put on stop and would he contact me quickly as time was running out. No reply. Phoned head office explained the situation and of course nobody knows anything about it! One guy,the office manager, did manage to get MSI to call on us but not for the Monday but first thing Tuesday! Second call to Andy Maloney Area Sales Manager, voice mail again.
Tuesday 12.35am and no MSI. Ring the head office of MSI and told that the engineer would be with us first thing Wednesday morning phoned Andy Maloney Area Sales Manager left message on voice mail.
So, that would put us out of time for deccelerometer testing and 10 Mots booked for Wednesday but hey, they will be there first thing right?
Wednesday arrives along with the MSI engineer who tells me (guess what) the part we need has to come from Liverpool and we will not get it until Thursday. Ring Andy Maloney Area Sales Manager and voice mail again.So go for Head of Sales Kieth McClaren and guess what? Voice mail.

Re: Expensive or not?

Posted by Joe McGeoghan on January 17, 2008, 7:00 am, in reply to "Re: Expensive or not?"
Joe McGeoghan

Welcome to my world, Harry.

Re: Expensive or not?

Posted by roy ritchie on January 18, 2008, 11:54 pm, in reply to "Re: Expensive or not?"
Roy Ritchie

Its nice to see Keith McClaren has not changed!Im still waiting for compensation for a bradbury two post lift problem i had in 1998,HEAD OF SALES!!

Ive since bought 5 new lifts (not bradbury ones)I would never deal with them again.

Re: Expensive or not?

Posted by Harry Anderson on April 2, 2008, 4:55 pm, in reply to "Re: Expensive or not?"
Harry Anderson

Well just a quick update on the Bradbury Saga,looks like we are off again, valve that was replaced on 13/11/2007 and now (suprise suprise) is out of warranty- requires replacement again. Parts are exactly the same as before and labour is also the same. Total cost around 260.00ukp.
I would implore anyone considering buying equipment that they give Bradbury and MSI a wide birth.

Re: Expensive or not?

Posted by Tony Gould on April 2, 2008, 7:48 pm, in reply to "Re: Expensive or not?"
Tony Gould

Hi Harry
Just a big thank you for putting me off buying a Bradbury which i would probably have brought through Partco. Purchaced a Rotary 5.5 tonn 4 post as they are not to far away from us at a price i could not refuse.
Delivery on time,fitted by local firm and after 6 weeks no problems.Fantastic Ramp
Hope this helps others in there deliberations when buying a lift
Regards
Tony

Re: Expensive or not?

Posted by Chris Colby ACP Group on April 2, 2008, 8:57 pm, in reply to "Re: Expensive or not?"
Chris Colby - Air Con Prod Grp

Hi Harry.
These firms rely on the fact you will not take them to court.

Under the sale of goods act 1974 this ramp is surely not fit for it's purpose.

I would ask for your money including out of warranty costs and if they will not cough take them to the small claims court. A little hassle but very satisfying.

If you are a rmi member or other you could use there legal department.

Dell computers refused to carry out a very expensive repair out of warranty when the fault had been decided in warranty (I did not find time to send back while in warranty). I had to pay for repair and get my computer back. Once I had got it back I pursued for costs to be reimbursed. There legal department said there was no way they would ever pay anything!

few months later when i found the time (you have 6 years to sue for breach of contract)filled in claim form sent with cheque to court (part of total claim) also claimed for interest etc. 2 days before court case they settled!!!!!!!!!

The law is on your side!

You could even try claiming for a replacement ramp and down time when it was not working.

sorry it's long winded but large companies just rely on the fact we cannot be bothered to fight them. My motto has always been don't ask, wont get.
Chris Colby
ACP Group

PS If you buy something on HP you are not the legal owner so you stop paying and tell the HP company to come and take it away and get refund because they are the supplier!

Re: Expensive or not?

Posted by Matt Elliott on April 10, 2008, 11:40 pm, in reply to "Expensive or not?"
Mattew Elliott

Hi Dave is that a Crypton 660?If so check my post in workshop trader,We've taken our's out so you could save a fortune for future repairs

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