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Nissan Primera 1.8 2001 - Code P0335 crank sensor fault - Fixed #

Posted by Glen Strachan on October 24, 2012, 2:06 pm

Year of Manufacture *: 2001
Engine Size and Code *: 1800
( Optional ) Scanner Used: pico / kts

Hi code gods !
I have a Primera in that has stored code p0335 crank sensor fault.
It has been elsewhere and had the cranks sensor replaced although I am not aware of the quality / make of sensor fitted.
Before I go down the timing chain road, does anyone have a crank/cam waveform to compare with the one I have ? LTFT is at -0.8 so I expect the chain is good and we probably have a poor quality sensor as wiring checks all look good.

Re: Nissan Primera 1.8

Posted by Glen Strachan User icon on October 24, 2012, 5:11 pm, in reply to "Nissan Primera 1.8"

on second thoughts, closer looking at the two waveforms, I can see variation where the cam and crank line up. Not a lot, but attimes I can see a distinct gap between the edge of the crank dropping to ground and the cam rising . Could this be slack in the chain ?

Re: Nissan Primera 1.8

Posted by James Eardley User icon on October 24, 2012, 6:09 pm, in reply to "Nissan Primera 1.8"

Hi Glen

I scope the cam and crank through
Ignition on, crank & start, idle, WOT, idle, ignition off,
You can normally see the sync shift throughout the capture especially crank & start and when the accel pedal is released after WOT,

Have you checked the crank signal at the ECU?

Also put some more time on the screen and dial your sample rate up.

Hth
James

Re: Nissan Primera 1.8

Posted by James Eardley User icon on October 24, 2012, 6:15 pm, in reply to "Re: Nissan Primera 1.8"

Why is the cam signal reading -2.0v ish on the base line?

Re: Nissan Primera 1.8

Posted by Mark Carter User icon on October 24, 2012, 11:09 pm, in reply to "Re: Nissan Primera 1.8"
Mark Carter

He's got it set on AC

Mark

Modern cars, Its all wizardry and witchcraft

Re: Nissan Primera 1.8

Posted by Glen Strachan User icon on October 25, 2012, 8:32 am, in reply to "Re: Nissan Primera 1.8"

If I had the sample rate faster it was clear that there is a small ammount of shift between cam and crank but I'm not sure how much is too much.
After speaking to the customer it has covered over 300 miles after the original crank sensor replacement before it put the light back on.

Re: Nissan Primera 1.8

Posted by James Eardley User icon on October 25, 2012, 10:22 am, in reply to "Re: Nissan Primera 1.8"
James Eardley

Hi Mark

Of course you are correct, I didn't notice that before.

Glen

You need to take channel B off AC coupled.

'If I had the sample rate faster it was clear that there is a small ammount of shift between cam and crank'

Under what conditions can you see the sync shifting?

How often does the fault code re occur?

Has the customer experienced any other symptoms other than the MIL being on?

If the code is re occuring then under what conditions does the MIL light up?

Is this the first time the MIL has been on in 300 miles?

Can you post a capture when you have seen the sync shifting? and point out what the conditions were at the time. ie, cranking,idling ect.

cheers
James

Re: Nissan Primera 1.8

Posted by Jim Power User icon on October 25, 2012, 11:25 am, in reply to "Re: Nissan Primera 1.8"
James Power

I had reason to research one similar recently.
Lots of good info in the archives includeing this one , thanks to Dave Hill.
Jim

Nissan Primera 1.8 16v 2001 - Lumpy tickover and rough cruising P0300, random misfire # - Dave Hill March 29, 2007, 10:34 pm

jim power

Re: Nissan Primera 1.8

Posted by Glen Strachan User icon on October 25, 2012, 1:07 pm, in reply to "Re: Nissan Primera 1.8"

ok, AC changed you can now see the variation these captures were both taken at idle

Re: Nissan Primera 1.8

Posted by Glen Strachan User icon on October 25, 2012, 1:23 pm, in reply to "Re: Nissan Primera 1.8"

Thanks for the link Jim, that pic looks just like mine although I have no unusual noises or rough running

Re: Nissan Primera 1.8

Posted by James Eardley User icon on October 25, 2012, 3:42 pm, in reply to "Re: Nissan Primera 1.8"
James Eardley

Glyn

You could try to capture the sync shift at different rev ranges (if you havn't already)

But I think you have got enough evidence to justify pulling the rocker cover and measuring the tensioner petrusion.

Have you cleared the code and the code has come back while the vehicle has been in your possesion?

Also is your crank signal taken at the ECU or sensor. It might be worth while just putting a channel at the sensor and a channel at the ECU and wiggling the wires while comparing.

good luck
James

Re: Nissan Primera 1.8

Posted by Ian Slattery User icon on October 25, 2012, 6:44 pm, in reply to "Re: Nissan Primera 1.8"

Hi Glen

I have just sent you a email of a good pattern. [no fault codes anyway].

I will try and post it on here if i can work out how to do it.

http://www.mediafire.com/?qx4mzer1w9f55r5

I am a bit of a novice to scoping so forgive me if its not perfect, but i think i would be looking at the chain.

I also have one for a 1.5 almera after the chain was renewed, which is the same as that. The almera had a crank sensor fault which cleared after the new chain.

Regards Ian.

Re: Nissan Primera 1.8

Posted by Jim Power User icon on October 25, 2012, 9:34 pm, in reply to "Re: Nissan Primera 1.8"
James Power

Hi Glen
I did one recently on a 04 Almera 1.5 vvt. Mil on and driving like a pig.
Code stored for cam sensor. It drove perfectly once the code was cleared. Scope pattern was similar to yours but steady.

Chain was slack and the tensioner was out about 25mm. After replacing it looked like this one below.

I saved captures but there on another laptop

Jim

Re: X reg Primera 1.8 16V - Sean Mc Gettigan April 2, 2007, 10:27 pm archived message

jim power

Re: Nissan Primera 1.8

Posted by Sean Mc Gettigan User icon on October 30, 2012, 4:23 pm, in reply to "Re: Nissan Primera 1.8"
Sean McGettigan

Here you go Glen

http://members5.boardhost.com/ukautotalk4/msg/archive/1175549229.html

Ps, forget looking for movement of the signals etc
If its worn it will be off constantly at idle without any further testing needed.

Regards
Sean

Re: Nissan Primera 1.8

Posted by george ambelas User icon on October 30, 2012, 8:36 pm, in reply to "Re: Nissan Primera 1.8"
George Ambelas

because a crank sensor gives a fast and repeated signal you need to evaluate it in replay where you can see events individualy this waveform was from an almera which sometimes would't start. looking at it on idle it looked perfectly good but searching in replay i could see that some events were deformed a new sensor cured it

Re: Nissan Primera 1.8

Posted by Sean Mc Gettigan User icon on October 30, 2012, 9:57 pm, in reply to "Re: Nissan Primera 1.8"
Sean McGettigan

Hi George,

'because a crank sensor gives a fast and repeated signal you need to evaluate it in replay'

I would say it depends on the situation at hand as to whether or not you 'need to evaluate it in replay'

In this case Glen was asking about a basic engine crank/cam timing check.
I was simply stating that there was no need in this situation to overcomplicate things and start getting into looking at phase shifting between the two signals, if the chain is worn the mechanical timing shift caused by the tensioner taking up the slack will be seen at idle (in a few seconds).

A lot of simple scope tests can become overcomplicated too easily in my opinion. Extract what you need in the easiest way possible and keep it simple whenever you can would be my advise.

Regards
Sean

Re: Nissan Primera 1.8

Posted by Dave Hill User icon on October 30, 2012, 11:15 pm, in reply to "Re: Nissan Primera 1.8"

""A lot of simple scope tests can become overcomplicated too easily in my opinion. Extract what you need in the easiest way possible and keep it simple whenever you can would be my advise. ""

Agreed Sean

In my animated example, I draw attention to the wandering effect purely because it is an interesting observation & something that might be useful.

My approach with jobs such as this is to firstly confirm acceptable cam & crank sensor output & then look for any signals that might suggest damage to the phonic wheel.

If you have access to a known good example then alls well, but if not, it only takes a few minutes to pop the top off & check the tensioner protrusion.

The diagnostic path of least resistance is the way.

Fixed #

Posted by Glen Strachan on November 13, 2012, 11:10 am, in reply to "Re: Nissan Primera 1.8"
Message modified by board administrator November 15, 2012, 12:58 pm

It was a timing chain kit sorted it
Thanks everyone for your input

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